FNV Newsletter December 1

FNV In Today's Issue: December 4 2000
*DID SHYNE REPRESENT?

Send comments, questions and concerns to Davey D
mailto:kingdave@sirius.com
The FNV Newsletter
written by Davey D
http://www.daveyd.com
http://www.rapstation.com
c 2000
All Rights Reserved

============================================

Last week Shyne appeared on the TV show politically incorrect with Bill Maher. As usual Maher went after Hip Hop and made sweeping statements..Shyne seemed to hold it down..Currently there's a debate going on at Lee Bailey's EUR Report http://www.eurweb.com as to whether or not Shyne was a poor representation of Hip Hop and Black people in general or whether or not he made salient points worth thinking about. from reading the transcript, I say he did well.. Read the transcript of the show which we got from http://abc.go.com/primetime/politicallyincorrect/pi_home.html Read the it and hit me back with your thoughts on Shyne's performance. mailto:kingdave@sirius.com

FYI We will running our FNV Feedback issue this Wednesday.. There you will see reader feedback on Charles Jones article 'Something To Ponder' as well as the issue concerning Shyne..

Davey D

POLITICALLY INCORRECT PANEL DISCUSSION.

Panel Discussion

[ Cheers and applause ]

Bill: I tell you --
I tell you, you guys got spoiled.
Okay.
Let us meet our panel.
A recording artist and Puff Daddy protege, his self-titled CD is in stores everywhere, Mr. Shyne.

[ Cheers and applause ]
How you doing?

Shyne: How you doing? Pleasure to meet you.

Bill: Sit right over there.

Shyne: All right.

Bill: She's one of our favorite conservative commentators and the president of the Polling Company, Kellyanne Fitzpatrick.

[ Cheers and applause ]
Hello, babe.
How are you doing?

Kellyanne: Good.

Bill: He is the star of his very own show called "Titus," Tuesdays at 8:30 on another network --
like I know that --
Fox.
Christopher Titus is right over here.

[ Cheers and applause ]
Good to see you back here.
And a celebrated musician and gifted actor, he is one of the heroic stars of "Gideon's Crossing," Wednesdays at 10:00 right here on ABC.
I can say that network.
Ruben Blades, ladies and gentlemen.

[ Cheers and applause ]

Ruben: Thank you.

Bill: Good to see you here.

Ruben: Nice to be here.

Bill: Thank you.

Ruben: Thank you.

Bill: Okay.
Well, I have been dying to get away from the elections morass --

Christopher: No, you haven't.

Bill: I have.
I get sick of these things before the audience does.
I really do, because I talk about it every night, and I think the audience is sick of it, too.
Aren't you sick of it a little bit?
[ Cheers and applause ]
Okay, so --

Shyne: Who did you vote for, Bill?

Bill: Who did --
I voted for Ralph Nader.

[ Cheers and applause ]
So I'm the reason the election isn't --

Kellyanne: If you're sick of it, there's an easy solution.

Bill: What's that?

Kellyanne: Seat the guy who won.

[ Cheers and applause ]

Christopher: Yeah, but who is that exactly?

Shyne: Al Gore.

Christopher: Who exactly is that?

Bill: Wait a second.
I just said I was sick of it.

[ Laughter ]

Christopher: I'm ready, let's go!
[ Laughter ]

Bill: All right, maybe we'll get to it later, but right now I want to talk about --
but Shyne, this is interesting.

Christopher: There you go.
You know, Bill, I am packing, so calm it down.

[ Laughter ]
I got your back, man.

Bill: Well, that's what I want to ask about this gun play.
You know, I just don't understand why it's necessary.
I mean, people call themselves gangsta rappers, but you know gangsters, they actually had a business to protect.
I don't know what business you're protecting.
I don't know what's at stake except your egos.

Kellyanne: Life and limb, pursuit of happiness.
Are you kidding? It's worse now than ever.

Bill: I'm asking him.

[ Laughter ]

Kellyanne: But you're looking at me.

Bill: Unless you were with --

Kellyanne: But you're looking at me.

[ Laughter and applause ]

Shyne: I mean, you know --

Bill: You're good-looking, okay?

Shyne: You know, I never --
I never knew that, you know, Al Capone or Meyer Lansky, you know, constituted what a gangster was, you know? I thought gangster was just a way of living, was like an economic thing.
Like even when the Italians or Sicilians came over here, it was more of a, you know, they had to find a way to eat.
You understand? So they organized their crimes.

Bill: Right.
And what does that have to do with what you guys are doing?

Shyne: Yeah, but who are "You guys"? Like, you know, you have, you know, urban people, you know, black people that have organized crime.

Bill: Rappers, rich rappers who are killing each other.
Just --
it's just about whose
[ Bleep ]
is longer.

Shyne: Oh, man.

Bill: Let's get real.

Shyne: I only know about --
I only know about two rappers that were killed, you understand, and nobody's ever been convicted in those murders, so I don't see how you can say rappers killing each other.

Bill: Well --

Shyne: That's kind of far-fetched, don't you think, Bill?

Bill: No, I don't.

[ Laughter ]
I mean --

Christopher: Bill, it's really, the rapper thing, it's not --
it's not rappers shooting at each other, it's shooting near each other.

[ Laughter ]
And what I don't understand --

Shyne: And even, even, back to what you're asking me, you hear me, it's like, you know --
When you say gangsta rap, you understand, it's, you know, rappers are people talking about what they've been through, just like you know, singers, Britney Spears talk about baby, one more time.
That's what she wants.
Rappers --
you know, hey that's what she wants.
If she wants one more time.
Rappers, rappers, you know, we talk about --

Bill: Ego.

Shyne: No, it's not about ego.

Bill: It's all about ego.

Shyne: It's about --
it's about economics.

Kellyanne: So what's wrong with that?

Bill: What's wrong with that?

Kellyanne: It has to do with the power of the individual.
It's becoming so --

Christopher: Here's what I think about it and, look, and I'm a white guy, so I don't have a lot to say about this, but, look --

Kellyanne: The number one rapper right now is white.
And the number one --

Christopher: I don't know where you came from, but I know where I came.
Here's the thing.
Two different areas, fine.
But then you get success and I don't know, my attitude, I don't know where the violence should stop, because if you're riding around in a solid gold hummer getting a
[ Bleep ]
from a solid gold dancer, it's time to put the weapons down.

[ Laughter ]
I mean, I don't know.

[ Applause ]
It's like, hey, life is good.
Moving on.

Shyne: That's what I want to know.
That's what I want to know.
I want to know why the most powerful man in the country, Bill Clinton, he don't put his guns down.
He got guys around him 24 hours protecting him.

Bill: Because he's doing a real job for real people.

[ Laughter ]

Shyne: So you're telling me --
you're telling me --
you're telling me making music isn't a real job?

Bill: Not like being the president, no.

Shyne: No, it is.
Because we --

Bill: Talk about ego.

Shyne: Well, no, no way.
No way, man.
We did --
we sell millions and millions and millions and millions of records.
You understand, just like Bill Clinton, he deals with millions and millions and millions of people in America --
we deal with --

Bill: Let me --

Shyne: We have more of a grasp on the people --

Bill: Bill Clinton --
let me hit you with something real basic.
Bill Clinton is a lot more important than you.

Shyne: Not at all.

Bill: Not at all?

Shyne: Not at all.
Not at all.

Christoper: Wait a minute.
Wait a minute.
Bill Clinton's last album sucked.

[ Laughter ]
Frankly, I could not --
no beat, no beat and he sampled some stuff from --
I didn't like.

Kellyanne: The second amendment --
the second amendment --

Shyne: Listen, the people --
the people, the people are more important than Bill Clinton.
How dare you say that?

Bill: The people.
You ain't the people.

Shyne: I am the people.
I vote.
I voted.
I voted for Al Gore.

[ Applause ]

Bill: Well --

Kellyanne: Bill, the second amendment --

Bill: I hope you didn't vote in Florida.
What?

Kellyanne: Hi.
How are you?
[ Laughter ]
The second amendment is no less important than the first amendment either.
This entire show, his music, my right to speak on the show, his right to not speak on the show is invented --

[ Laughter ]
--
In the first amendment.
Is invented in the first amendment.

Ruben: I'm still trying to find a question.

[ Laughter ]

Kellyanne: The second question --
the second amendment is no less important.
In other words, and it doesn't matter who's using guns for what purpose.
If we don't like the fact that almost 30 states in this country have passed concealed carry, that you can protect yourself without anybody knowing, that the fact is a growing number of people who are buying guns are single women who want to protect themselves.
If a rapist comes to my door --

Bill: Yeah, but we're not talking --

Kellyanne: --
I can't sit him down and offer him latte and reason with him.

Bill: But Kellyanne --

Kellyanne: I need to equalize --

Bill: Right.

Kellyanne: --
His physical dominance over me.

Bill: But we're not talking about people who are shooting rapists coming into their homes.
We're talking about people who are shooting each other for no damn good reason, and that's what I was saying.
It's even less of a reason than gang --
real gangsters --

Kellyanne: You support assisted suicide.
You support Jack Kevorkian, assisted-suicide and you don't support his right to do what he wants?

Christopher: Hold on, hold on.
Anyway, it's not like --
look, Frank Sinatra never got mad and went after --
oh, wait a minute.
Sorry.

[ Laughter ]

[ Applause ]
Sorry.
Sorry, bad example.

Ruben: What is the argument?

Shyne: I don't know.

Bill: My argument is that in the rap community, they're shooting each other for no --

Shyne: Who's shooting each other?

Bill: Are you denying that there's a lot of gun play in the hip-hop community?

Shyne: There's a lot of gun play in American communities.
What makes --
what makes the hip-hop community --

Bill: Yeah, you people are playing with guns.
It's for a reason.
It may not be a good reason.
It may be like, "I want your money." That's a better reason than, "I'm a better rapper than you," bang, bang! And it's all about ego.

[ Applause ]
That's what I'm saying.
That's my question.

Ruben: I personally think --

Shyne: You know, the people in the audience clapping about that, yeah, y'all are real uneducated.

Bill: Well, what is --

Shyne: And y'all --
honestly, honestly, and it's no disrespect to you.
I'm going to enlighten you, because what this man is talking about is foolishness.

Bill: Well, what is the shooting about?

Shyne: He is making no sense.
He just wants to talk to hear himself.

Bill: What is the shooting about? Why did Tupac and Biggie get shot?

Shyne: Well, listen, and that's what the people in Las Vegas --

Bill: What did they get shot over?

Shyne: That's what the people in Las Vegas and Los Angeles are investigating.
Those are two isolated incidents in 25 years of rap music.
Ha ha.
What's so funny about that?

Bill: Because I don't think they're isolated.

Shyne: Okay.

Bill: Does anyone really think that gun play in that community is isolated but it's, oh, an aberration?

Ruben: I think, basically, you know, and I have to, now I'm gonna make a comment on the fact that the question here is --
as far as people having guns is, where do you draw the line? You know what I mean? I understand what you are saying about protecting yourself, but I don't know of any place anymore where you can be safe.
If you have a little kid --
wait.
If you have a little kid that goes to school and the little kid sees his teacher shot dead and a couple of schoolmates shot --

Bill: Very rare that that happens.

Ruben: It happens here.

Kellyanne: The aberration.

Ruben: But my question is, would you then think that it would be smart to give little Timmy an uzi for Christmas?

Kellyanne: But that's not legal.
It's not legal for Timmy to have an uzi or a handgun or anything.

Ruben: Right.
So you're saying that a woman that doesn't go and get a gun legally doesn't have the right to shoot this rapist?

Kellyanne: Of course she has the right.

Ruben: So what are we talking about? If you want a gun in this country, you can find a gun anywhere you want.

Kellyanne: But she's not 6 and her name's not Timmy.

Ruben: Where do you draw the line with guns?

Kellyanne: No, no, I'm tired of parents thinking that the rest of us should raise their children.
He and his music are not in charge of raising my kids, I am.
When they get on the school bus and they go to school --

[ Cheers and applause ]
I don't abdicate my --

Bill: Okay, we have to take a commercial.
Way over time.
We'll come back to this.

[ Applause ]

Bill: Now, tonight, magician David Blaine ended his 58 hours encased in a block of ice.
Isn't that something? He said there's really nothing that can compare it to, except maybe perhaps being married to that Katherine Harris chick.

[ Laughter ]

[ Applause ]
Okay.
We went over our time, but I'm sorry.
You were about to speak when I had to break.

Shyne: Yeah, I mean, I just want to make a few points.

Bill: Yeah.

Shyne: This is bigger than rappers.
You know.
You know, the NRA, the lobbyists, the gun lobbyists, they make guns.
You know, ain't no uzis made in Harlem.
And number two, you know, rappers, you know, let's be real.
They aren't, you know ivy league students and higher learning people.
They're people that come from a community where there's a lot of drugs, CIA distributing --

Bill: Well, the Dixie Chicks aren't that bright either, but they don't shoot at each other.

Shyne: Yeah, yeah, but nonetheless, nonetheless, nonetheless, you know, what you're doing is you're ignoring a problem that exists in America, and that's why that problem is going to continue.

Bill: What is the problem I'm ignoring?

Shyne: Is that violence, that unemployment, it all has to do with economics, and when you have all these people --

Bill: Economics? These are rich people shooting each other.

Shyne: Rich people? No, no, no.
What do you think? They were born rich?

Bill: Are you poor?

Shyne: Were they born rich? I wasn't born rich.
I had to watch my mother work seven days a week breaking her back cleaning people's houses --

Bill: But lots of people are not born rich and they don't, like, shoot each other continuing on into their prosperity.

Shyne: No, no, no.
But what I'm trying to tell you is, what people are continuing to shoot each other in the prosperity.
You gave me two incidents where no rappers were convicted of anything.

Bill: Well, not convicted.
I can say that about a lot of people.

Shyne: Well, everybody is accused.
I mean, George Bush was arrested for drinking and driving.

Bill: Okay.
Well, if you're going to deny the premise that the rap world is violent, then really, you can't even --

Shyne: I mean, the world is violent.
This world is violent.
Martin Scorsese makes a bunch of violent films.

Christopher: And the way this election is going, I believe George Bush or Al Gore, somebody is going pop a cap in someone's ass.

[ Laughter ]
Right.
He's right.
Violence is across the board.

Shyne: When Bill Clinton decides he wants to go to the Middle East and start a war over oil, isn't that violent?
[ Applause ]

Bill: It's apples and oranges, yeah.

Shyne: Apples and oranges.
Violence is violence, man.

Bill: Violence is --
no, violence for a reason.

Shyne: When people kill --

Bill: Like World War II was violent for a good reason.

Shyne: It's World War II in the ghetto.
People want to eat.
They're starving.

Bill: Oh, they're not starving.

Shyne: Why are they not starving?

Bill: Because there's plenty of food.

Shyne: Where's the food at?

Bill: In this country, poor people are fat.
There are fat poor people in America.
Nobody is starving in America.

[ Applause ]

Kellyanne: And if they are starving, frankly, Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, people like that who are millionaires, they're the only millionaire ministers I know who don't have a single person in the congregation.

Bill: Al Sharpton is in Florida now.
He is on a 15-minute hunger strike.

[ Laughter ]

Christopher: I don't know.

Ruben: I think I have to say one more --
you know, violence is all over the place.
It's not just one segment.
I mean, violence is all over the place.

Bill: Well, that's when --

Christopher: Whose responsibility? When do you go okay, you know what, I had a crappy life.
You had a crappy life.
We all had a crappy life to some degree, when do you take responsibility and go, it stops now?

Bill: Exactly.

[ Applause ]
That's all.

Shyne: When does America take responsibility and start giving some educational funds to these inner-city communities and start doing things --

[ Talking at the same time ]
Listen, when you're uneducated, and you're a barbarian and you're primitive because there's no one there to groom you or nourish you or show you the right way, you're always going to go the wrong way.

[ Applause ]

Bill: Yeah, and does that go through your whole life even after --

Shyne: For some people it does.

Bill: Really?

Shyne: There are dysfunctional people in the world.

Bill: Well, somebody ought to take them aside and bitch-slap them upside the head and say, you know what, like you said --

[ Laughter ]

Christopher: But one thing is that Shyne's been actually recording and writing music since he was 16 years old.
So for all the stuff that has happened, whatever his history is, he's one of the people that actually is grabbing himself and actually trying to rise up.
He really is, I mean, 16 years old, you start writing music.
He actually is.

[ Applause ]

Ruben: You know, going back to --
you have to look at things in terms of their background.
You know, some people are just --
look at what's happening with Robert Downey Jr., for instance.
You know --

[ Laughter ]

Christopher: No.

Ruben: Wait a second.
Wait a second.
The situations and background and you have to understand that.

Bill: Yes.

Kellyanne: I'm sorry.
Are we supposed to feel sorry for him?

Ruben: I think the guy's sick and he needs to be helped.
That's what I think.

Kellyanne: I think the guy is spoiled and selfish.

[ Applause ]

Ruben: I think --

Christopher: Okay.

Ruben: Wait a second.
You can't generalize, and I don't want to generalize.
You know, and I don't think it's an excuse to come from a working-class background like I do, and I'm not in that position, but I had a home.
I had people who cared for me and taught me things, you know.
But by the same token, what I do want to say to you respectfully is that no matter what happened in your past, now you're an older person and you know better.
And now is the time for you to change whatever it was that the background made you do at one point.
And it's your choice.

Shyne: Thank you.

[ Cheers and applause ]

Bill: But let me ask you.
Does that apply to Robert Downey Jr.? And I know what you're saying.
He smoked pot when he was, like, 6 years old or something.
His parents were and that is wrong, way wrong.

Ruben: I think that the guy is sick.
I mean, the same thing with Strawberry.
I don't --
I'm not going to start, like, accusing this man because he's weak.
I mean, at this time, we know these guys are going to do it again and again and again, and I think it's ridiculous to think that they're going to just get out of it by themselves.
I think that something should be devised to make them react, whether it is to put him in a place for a year and a half or whatever until there's some --

Kellyanne: But those people had even more resources available to them.
They've had too many resources available to them.

Ruben: And I'm not talking about these two people in general.

[ Talking at one time ]

Bill: Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

Shyne: Rappers are supposed to get a couple million dollars and then change, but what I want to know is, Frank Sinatra was, you know, America's greatest singer, and he still went to Sam Giancana's place in Las Vegas to hang out for the weekend.
Joe Kennedy, Jack Kennedy, they all had ties with the mob, and they were presidents of the United States and rich, rich, rich men.

[ Applause ]
They had more money than Puff Daddy and I could ever have.

Bill: I don't remember Frank Sinatra or JFK shooting anybody in a nightclub, however.

Shyne: I mean, that has nothing to do with them than their ties with the Mafia.
You understand?

Bill: Yeah, they had ties with the Mafia.

Shyne: That's proven.
It hasn't been proven that anyone has shot anyone in a nightclub.
That's --

Christopher: 'Cause I understand it.
I try to kill in comedy clubs, and some of the rappers try to kill in nightclubs.
That's just the way it is.

[ Laughter ]

Bill: I gotta take a commercial once again.
Wow.

Announcer: Join us tomorrow, when our guests will be comedian Robert Klein, MTV's Kurt Loder, actress Salli Richardson and conservative commentator Kim Serafin.

Bill: Researchers are saying now that there is a new impotence drug called Kiowas that is just as effective as Viagra without the vision distortion that you get with Viagra.
And they say with any luck, seniors will be able to have sex and still vote for the president they really wanted to vote for.

[ Laughter ]

[ Applause ]
Okay.
Speaking of the president you really wanted to vote for, what a good segue.
You mentioned Jesse Jackson an Al Sharpton down there in Florida protesting, but they're not the only ones, you know.
The Republicans flew in people into Miami and Jerry Nadler, Democratic Congressman said, "There's the smell of fascism in the air," and I got to defend the Republicans here.
How come when they go down to protest, it's fascism, but when the Democrats do it it's just voice of the people?

Christopher: No, it's not.
Exactly.

[ Applause ]
And the Republicans had --
you know, first of all, it was hard on them.
It was like they had to march, because they had to put like 25 people in a Lear jet.
It was rough on a lot of the Republicans.

[ Laughter ]
They went crazy, and they flipped over a Volvo station wagon.
It was --

[ Laughter ]
And they believe in something.

Bill: They had outside agitators.

Christopher: That's right, it was crazy.
They broke some Baccarat crystal.
It was crazy.

Kellyanne: The answer is simple.
The answer is simple.
Because the Republicans aren't black.
Our leaders out there aren't Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton, because the presumption is --

Bill: Yeah, but they were at the convention.

Kellyanne: --
That black people cannot be racist.
That if Jesse Jackson stands up, what he's saying is gospel truth.
He is race stating down there.
If I were a black man or a woman in Florida, I would tell him to shut his mouth and go home, because he is insulting them by believing that --

[ Scattered applause ]

Christopher: Come on, give it up for the lady, people!
[ Cheers and applause ]

Kellyanne: By believing that somehow --

Bill: But blacks were disenfranchised in Florida.

Kellyanne: Bill, Bill, the turnout among black voters was remarkably increasing.

Bill: The turnout, but how many were counted?

Kellyanne: No, no, no, no.
All of them, most of them.

[ Applause ]

Bill: Yeah, they turned out.

Kellyanne: No, and I have to say --

Bill: They tried to vote.

Kellyanne: I have to say, the sound of 80-year-old Jewish women claiming that other people are whining is really just a bit much.

[ Audience booing ]

Shyne: I definitely --
I definitely agree that the Republicans have a right to go down there and protest.
Now are they merited? Are they warranted in that? That's my opinion is, no, but they have a right to go down there.

Ruben: I'll tell you one thing about ballots.
You know, I'm from Panama, Latin America.
And in Latin America, we know about stealing elections and fraud.

[ Laughter ]

Christopher: You guys started that, didn't you?

Ruben: I don't know who learned it from whom, but we know that.

[ Laughter ]
And I'll tell you one thing, though, I'll tell you one thing, our ballots are clear, man.

[ Laughter ]
I mean, they steal the election, but we know who we voted for.

Bill: Right.

[ Laughter ]

Ruben: I don't know here.
No, we're very concerned because this is a twist we never thought of.

[ Laughter ]

Bill: I can't.
I got to take another commercial.
We'll be right back.

[ Applause ]

[ Applause ]

Bill: Okay.
This is Mr. Shyne's record.
You got the goods and the groove.
I'll give you that.
Tomorrow, we got Robert Klein, Kurt Loder, Salli Richardson and Kim Serafin.

[ Applause ]

Give us your 2 cents! Mouse over and mouth off on the Politically Incorrect message board!
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Politically Incorrect with Bill Maher

Executive Producers
Bill Maher
Nancy Geller
Kevin Hamburger
Marilyn Willson

abc.com Go Network

========END OF NEWSLETTER================

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